The topic of the day seems to be the defeat of Viktor Orbán in Hungary. The New York Times, the Washington Post, and the Wall Street Journal all have editorials, columns, and op-eds about it. Rather than commenting on specific opinion pieces, I’m going to comment on their existence.
Hungary has a population of fewer than 10 million people. These people speak a distinct language, unrelated to any of the languages of their neighbors. From the 16th to the 20th centuries it was ruled by a succession of empires, Ottoman, Hapsburg, etc. It should not be surprising if at least some Hungarians view the European Union in that same light.
Most of the opinion pieces I have seen are primarily equal and opposite reactions to President Trump’s verbal support for Orbán and attempting to draw lessons from that election for the United States. Most of their writers clearly know little about Hungarian politics or Hungary’s problems, treating the country primarily as a cautionary tale or a model for American politics. How can such a small country with a culture of its own continue to survive with a declining population? How can it accept mass immigration of immigrants who don’t speak their language or even have much interest in doing so? The election is over but those challenges remain.
Hungary is not being discussed on its own terms. It is being used. Migrants use it as a transit country on their way to Germany or Sweden. American commentators use it as a proxy for their own domestic arguments. In both cases Hungary is a means to an end rather than an object of understanding.
When I speak even a little Hungarian to my Hungarian-speaking neighbors, they are astonished and delighted. That reaction says more about the country’s linguistic isolation than any number of policy papers. It also helps explain why assimilation is not a trivial matter there.
I am American. I did not support Orbán. I do not support his successor. Hungary’s problems are its own and I’m content to let the Hungarians solve their own problems in their own ways. I wish more Americans would do the same.
It’s not so much Hungary as it is Orban. Besides the level of corruption and control by the central government he established he has made it difficult for NATO and the EU to function, slowing funding for Ukraine. He did that while, IIRC, Hungary receiving the most financial support from the EU on a per capita basis. He was also pro-Putin. On the plus side as seen by MAGA he is anti-immigration, supports using government to achieve religious goals and at least gives lip service to the importance of religion, believes it’s ok to use government to control media as long as it does what he wants. So while I would agree people speak about Hungary without knowing much about the country we know a lot about Orban.
Steve
You know what you are told about him from sources that have their own agendas. As I say, I have little knowledge about Hungarian politics, don’t support Orban, and don’t support his successor. I think the best course of action for Americans is to focus on America rather than on politics in other countries about which they know very little.
On that basis we then cannot believe anything about anybody. You choose sources which you think are credible just like everyone else does. What is kind of unique about Urban is that when interviewed he has admitted to the corruption but doesnt view it as corruption per se. He thinks/thought that his government had the right to take over media and individual enterprises because he was doing it to save the culture of Hungary. It just so happened those who benefitted economically were his friends and family. They were the only ones he could trust. Besides Urban openly talking about and trying to justify his corruption the delaying of money going Ukraine is pubic record stuff.
I guess you could claim Orban has his own agenda in admitting this stuff in interviews but then you are getting kind of weird.
Steve
Please believe me when I say that politicians NEVER view corruption as corruption. And nearly all are corrupt. It is not avoidable. It’s only a matter of degree.
??? Most of them go to great lengths to try to hide it. Most deny it when confronted with the evidence. I haven’t spoken directly with that many politicians so I dont know if they view it as corruption but its clear that they believe if they are exposed it will be harmful to them as what they are doing is illegal or unethical.
What’s odd to me is that it’s pretty clear is that voters mostly dont seem to care. Even when caught red handed if a politician doesnt resign and sticks it out and is seen giving voters the results they want the voters dont seem to care.
Steve
You obviously don’t live in Chicago.
No, but New Jersey is almost as bad and when I was working I worked there a bit. Local officials were pretty open about asking for bribes or their equivalent. However, those who aspired to higher office always made some efforts to hide what they were doing. In PA where I live it depends more upon the locale. In the very rural counties the corruption is pretty open. In larger towns and cities more of an effort is made to hide stuff.
Steve