Is This Cigar Just a Cigar?

I was astonished to awaken this morning to find both the editors of the New York Times:

A first step in resetting the conversation is to eliminate the debt ceiling before its next scheduled appearance in 2025. President Biden has brushed aside calls for his administration to pursue a legal ruling that the ceiling is unconstitutional. In doing so, he is repeating the mistake he made last fall, when he failed to press for legislation to repeal the ceiling. A case pending in federal court in Boston, brought by federal workers concerned that a default would come at the expense of their pensions, offers a potential vehicle. Other legal avenues also should be explored. It makes sense to pursue a ruling while there is no imminent danger of hitting the ceiling. If courts reject the legal challenges, that would also be clarifying.

Any substantive deal will eventually require a combination of increased revenue and reduced spending, not least because any politically viable deal will require a combination of those options. Both parties will have to compromise: Republicans must accept the necessity of collecting what the government is owed, and of imposing taxes on the wealthy. Democrats must recognize that changes to Social Security and Medicare, the major drivers of federal spending growth going forward, should be on the table. Anything less will prove fiscally unsustainable.

That will require painful choices. But the failure to make those choices also has a price — and the price tag is increasing rapidly.

and the editors of the Washington Post:

Unless Americans are willing to live with a substantially smaller military, reduced Social Security payments, more crowded classrooms and other diminishments in what their government provides, lawmakers need to find about $2 trillion in additional tax revenue over the coming decade, on top of the money-saving budget reforms that we have detailed elsewhere. Congress’s task is to raise the money without dulling efficiency and warping incentives to grow, innovate and work.

writing about the urgent moral necessity of increasing taxes. Just to give a quick take the preferences of the WaPo editors are eliminate the “carried interest loophole” (disagree), let the Trump tax cuts expire (agree about personal income taxes, disagree about business taxes), and imposing a carbon tax (regressive).

I think there are two points worth making. The first is that taxes are by definition withdrawing money from the private sector. That always reduces economic activity.

The second is that raising tax rates is hard enough but generating additional revenue is that real kicker. Consider this graph:

As you can see although there’s considerable noise in the federal tax receipts as a percentage of GDP it has remained within the same range for nearly 80 years regardless of changes in the tax code.

State and local tax revenues have skyrocketed over that period. When they declaim about federal revenues, they’re actually saying that the federal government needs to break through that 22% barrier.

I know there are lots of countries that pay a larger percent of GDP in taxes than we do. Most of them have much higher social cohesion than we do, too. As a consequence they receive more in government services than we do. Our problems are (in descending order of importance) poor ROI on government spending, too much government spending, not enough tax revenue.

12 comments… add one
  • CuriousOnlooker Link

    This needs to be highlighted, “As a consequence they receive more in government services than we do. Our problems are (in descending order of importance) poor ROI on government spending…”

    If government was providing its goods and services at a cheap price, then the concerns about too much government spending are immaterial, and increasing revenue makes sense because we would more goods and services.

    But this is a country where a km of new subway lines cost 10x European countries, never mind China; where we spend more on the military then the next 10 militaries combined, yet not arguably more secure than those ten countries, etc etc.

  • CuriousOnlooker Link

    Maybe it is me; but I believe $2 trillion is a big underestimate.

    Look at defense; where current projections is military spending as a percentage of GDP goes from 3.1% to 2.8% in the next 10 years.

    But if you look at geopolitics, given the hot hostilities with Russia, rapidly deteriorating relations with China, an ambivalent middle east where US dependence for energy will be increasing again — it augurs for a much higher national defense budget.

    If we go back to 5% of GDP on the military (like the 80’s when there was a cold war) — that’s a 66% increase or $500 billion a year. Over 10 years, that $5 trillion dollars.

    The other one is interest rates. The current CBO projections is the government can borrow at 2% for much of the next decade. The current rate is 5%.

  • Andy Link

    TANSTAAFL

  • bob sykes Link

    Where do the taxes come from? A service economy is inherently a low wage, low tax revenue economy. You can’t fund government spending by borrowing indefinitely unless the economy is growing rapidly.

    The problem now is funding Social Security and Medicare. Benefits cannot be reduced, because too many people really need them. You cannot default on the debt, and interest payments are rising.

    The only source of “income” is military spending. A major reduction in our military, at least 50%, is inevitable.

    Some senior government official in the UK (Tobias?) said very recently that the UK must declare martial law and go to a war economy so that the UK can go to war with Russia. WTF!!!??

    Dear Sweet Jesus, wake me its over.

  • steve Link

    I think you were the one who recently referred to persistence theory. It’s true until it’s not. I dont know if we can increase federal revenues but we haven’t made much of an effort. The Dems might increase tax rates but the GOP cuts IRS staffing so rich people dont have to pay, then they cut taxes when in office. Neither party is willing to cut spending except in very visible and meaningless exceptions.

    We are just playing chicken until it get bad enough someone has to do something. Whether it’s aimed more at cutting spending or raising taxes will depend on who gets caught in office at the time.

    Steve

  • The Dems might increase tax rates but the GOP cuts IRS staffing so rich people dont have to pay, then they cut taxes when in office.

    Sadly, that’s a non sequitur. As this post from Syracuse University observes, “making rich people pay” is not what the IRS does in practice:

    During FY 2022, years of budget cuts and increased needs in other sectors left the IRS with only around 1,400 staff-years of revenue agent time to apply to the 165 million income tax 1040 returns that were filed. Even though the IRS applied one-fourth of these hours to auditing millionaires, still barely over 1 out of every 100 millionaires were audited.

    and

    The taxpayer class with unbelievably high audit rates – five and a half times virtually everyone else – were low-income wage-earners taking the earned income tax credit. This credit is provided to offset the taxes for the lowest wage-earners in the country. As we previously have reported, [3] this group of taxpayers have historically been targeted not because they account for the most tax under-reporting, but because they are easy marks in an era when IRS increasingly relies upon correspondence audits yet doesn’t have the resources to assist taxpayers or answer their questions.

  • Drew Link

    “The Dems might increase tax rates but the GOP cuts IRS staffing so rich people dont have to pay, then they cut taxes when in office.”

    Hmmm. It appears that whether or not Merrick Garland is AG (and your last name is Biden) is a better predictor of whether the rich have to pay….

    I wonder. Did Hunter’s wife, ex-wife and Joes grandchildren report all that “consulting services” income for the, no doubt, sage advice they provided Ukraine, Romania or China?

  • steve Link

    The reason the IRS audits so many poor people is that it is automated. Easy for the computer to do it. However, very low percentages of wealthy get audited specifically because of IRS staff cuts. IIRC i think the ratio is for every dollar spent on the audit we collect $8.

    Steve

  • Drew Link

    The reason so few wealthy get audited is that a) they have professionals prepare their returns, who steer them clear of trouble and 2) the wealthy will fight the IRS. The IRS knows they are digging dry holes.

    I’m amazed no one commented on the elephant in the room. The taxing authorities’ take is 40%. When you consider that most residual income is spent, sales taxes move that number easily to 50%. We get jack for government services, and we fork over 50% to politicians to play with for their own purposes. If the governments were private entities they would be charged with false advertising, if not fraud.

  • steve Link

    “The IRS knows they are digging dry holes.”

    Nope. The wealthy do fight but the return on dollars spent has always been good.

    Steve

  • Dave: What’s your reasoning behind wanting to preserve the carried interest loophole? It appears this is only the third-ever mention on this site of “carried interest” and neither of the other two does any analysis.

  • The tax reform that I would favor is abolishing the income tax entirely in favor of a sales tax or VAT prebated to ensure progressivity. What we’re doing is not working.

    I don’t have a strong opinion of the carried interest deduction. I’ll leave defending it to someone else. I do think that private investment is more efficient than state subidies. Said another way don’t curb private investment so the federal government can spend more.

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