Society has obviously coarsened enough that this has long gone out the door. Like nearly every politician, McCain leaves a mixed legacy, but it is a shame that at least in the immediate aftermath of his death some people are unwilling or unable to acknowledge the positive parts of his life.
Society has obviously coarsened enough that this has long gone out the door.
Because it is, and always has been, a farce. Speak not ill of the dead? Focus on the good things they’ve done? How many reading this will apply that to Joseph Stalin? Or Pol Pot. Or Adolph Hitler. Nobody will, because it isn’t a standard, it’s a personal rule selectively applied according to personal bias.
McCain sold himself as someone who didn’t need hagiography and that promptly became his hagiography. And I assume, at a certain level, he believed his own press. It’s less about speaking ill of the dead and more about why America has become so ghastly when it comes to dying and truth. Funerals on television are largely indistinguishable from the NFL honoring the troops at halftime. Humans don’t actually require this sort of BS 24/7. it’s completely optional.
“It’s less about speaking ill of the dead and more about why America has become so ghastly when it comes to dying and truth. ”
That’s the way it’s always been though. Watch the JFK funeral on Youtube and you’ll still hear people of a certain age fawn over JFK as if he and his family were royalty.
It’s also not just an American thing or even a culturally Western thing.
Personally, I try to look at the whole person and not simply focus on the aspects I liked or didn’t like. No one, especially those in politics, is going to be free from criticism and I certainly had my criticisms of McCain (I could not, in good conscience, vote for him in 2008 and believed he had become unbalanced), but overall I think his contributions were positive.
For military personnel, in particular, his legacy will endure.
“Suddenly “The Cat” said to me, “Do you want to go home?”
I was astonished, and I tell you frankly that I said that I would have to think about it. I went back to my room, and I thought about it for a long time. At this time I did not have communication with the camp senior ranking officer, so I could get no advice. I was worried whether I could stay alive or not, because I was in rather bad condition. I had been hit with a severe case of dysentery, which kept on for about a year and a half. I was losing weight again.
But I knew that the Code of Conduct says, “You will not accept parole or amnesty,” and that “you will not accept special favors.” For somebody to go home earlier is a special favor. There’s no other way you can cut it.
I went back to him three nights later. He asked again, “Do you want to go home?” I told him “No.” He wanted to know why, and I told him the reason. I said that Alvarez [first American captured] should go first, then enlisted men and that kind of stuff.â€
For me, McCain’s example as a POW under brutal circumstances, lent his experience to training a generation of military personnel on how to conduct themselves honorably in perilous circumstances such as he endured. McCain set a high standard of how US servicemembers should handle themselves – to return home with Honor, endure the situation with courage, and remain committed to country and their fellow servicemembers.
JFK’s image was based on something deep and American for many people. My grandfather kept scrapbooks that ran from the 30s to the 60s. He grew up in an old PA farm town that survived the Depression. You can see pride in how he and his brothers, who were on the board of the bank and struggled to keep it afloat, and how this struggle was connected to FDR, and this connection, for good or bad, extended to JFK. In the imagination of old school New Dealers like my grandfather, Kennedy was a royal descendant of Roosevelt. And that connection was earned.
Half of American history is basically people who have a connection, however flawed, like my grandfather. They didn’t advertise it. They kept it private, but they studied and did the work and tried to live. The other half are the people who have no connection, and they’re the ones who consistently about what America is and isn’t, as if they have a clue.
People like JFK and McCain had the family connections/influence/wealth to avoid serving in places or ways that were actually hazardous to begin with, yet they didn’t take that path. Given all of our other politicians and pundits who went to great lengths to avoid serving in times of conflict, it makes them stand out. They both served heroically in their own ways. For better or worse, I think that builds up a lot of goodwill. trust, authenticity or whatever you want to call it. Such a contrast with what we have now.
I didn’t watch the funeral and I guess I’m not surprised, but having Kissinger speak at McCain’s is pretty messed up. The guy worked for a man who committed treason in order to become President. Kissinger didn’t care at all that Nixon interfered with Paris peace talks. Did McCain? The man survived five years of torture, and for what?
To me what you’re describing with FDR and JFK sounds like noblesse oblige and I would agree it seems largely absent today.
But I also wonder how FDR or JFK would fare in a world with cable news and social media.
They also need to be remembered completely, and not just based on myths, fantasies and the good things they did.
steve,
Well said. You could add several others to that list.
The upper classes used to have a sense of duty and honor that compelled at least some of them to serve their country – duty and honor seem comparatively rare today across our entire society.
Andy,
It’s that, I think, but also identification with strikes and subversion. FDR was a tricky figure, and for someone like my grandfather and his family, he was connected to something that came out of labor struggles. My father’s side were very proud of being ‘scientific’ farmers and, in their minds, gentlemen. But they also smuggled food past the National Guard during coal strikes. Or so the story goes. And they despised their relatives who went big and moved to the metropolis of Reading. Which used to be fancy!
I also think that Roosevelt coming in via radio to a completely isolated farm village in a PA valley with his great voice must have been unearthly.
I never met my grandfather, but he had an odd life. He was in the Army in France in 1918 and then came right back to where he grew up, and barely travelled and never spoke about the war, or even what he saw. He was elected as a state congressman for one term and then went back to the farm. I’ve always assumed he straddled different worlds without really knowing where to go.
Which is good for him, as there is much revisionism and fantasy in the air.
Not speaking negatively of a corpse has become lying to make it look better than it was.
Society has obviously coarsened enough that this has long gone out the door. Like nearly every politician, McCain leaves a mixed legacy, but it is a shame that at least in the immediate aftermath of his death some people are unwilling or unable to acknowledge the positive parts of his life.
Steve
Because it is, and always has been, a farce. Speak not ill of the dead? Focus on the good things they’ve done? How many reading this will apply that to Joseph Stalin? Or Pol Pot. Or Adolph Hitler. Nobody will, because it isn’t a standard, it’s a personal rule selectively applied according to personal bias.
John McCain III was born well heeled. Raised some hell when young, but never really let his namesake down. Good man.
He was a man of honor who behaved honorably during his captivity. He also had poor judgment. The one did not compensate for the other.
McCain sold himself as someone who didn’t need hagiography and that promptly became his hagiography. And I assume, at a certain level, he believed his own press. It’s less about speaking ill of the dead and more about why America has become so ghastly when it comes to dying and truth. Funerals on television are largely indistinguishable from the NFL honoring the troops at halftime. Humans don’t actually require this sort of BS 24/7. it’s completely optional.
“It’s less about speaking ill of the dead and more about why America has become so ghastly when it comes to dying and truth. ”
That’s the way it’s always been though. Watch the JFK funeral on Youtube and you’ll still hear people of a certain age fawn over JFK as if he and his family were royalty.
It’s also not just an American thing or even a culturally Western thing.
Personally, I try to look at the whole person and not simply focus on the aspects I liked or didn’t like. No one, especially those in politics, is going to be free from criticism and I certainly had my criticisms of McCain (I could not, in good conscience, vote for him in 2008 and believed he had become unbalanced), but overall I think his contributions were positive.
For military personnel, in particular, his legacy will endure.
For me, McCain’s example as a POW under brutal circumstances, lent his experience to training a generation of military personnel on how to conduct themselves honorably in perilous circumstances such as he endured. McCain set a high standard of how US servicemembers should handle themselves – to return home with Honor, endure the situation with courage, and remain committed to country and their fellow servicemembers.
JFK’s image was based on something deep and American for many people. My grandfather kept scrapbooks that ran from the 30s to the 60s. He grew up in an old PA farm town that survived the Depression. You can see pride in how he and his brothers, who were on the board of the bank and struggled to keep it afloat, and how this struggle was connected to FDR, and this connection, for good or bad, extended to JFK. In the imagination of old school New Dealers like my grandfather, Kennedy was a royal descendant of Roosevelt. And that connection was earned.
Half of American history is basically people who have a connection, however flawed, like my grandfather. They didn’t advertise it. They kept it private, but they studied and did the work and tried to live. The other half are the people who have no connection, and they’re the ones who consistently about what America is and isn’t, as if they have a clue.
People like JFK and McCain had the family connections/influence/wealth to avoid serving in places or ways that were actually hazardous to begin with, yet they didn’t take that path. Given all of our other politicians and pundits who went to great lengths to avoid serving in times of conflict, it makes them stand out. They both served heroically in their own ways. For better or worse, I think that builds up a lot of goodwill. trust, authenticity or whatever you want to call it. Such a contrast with what we have now.
Steve
I didn’t watch the funeral and I guess I’m not surprised, but having Kissinger speak at McCain’s is pretty messed up. The guy worked for a man who committed treason in order to become President. Kissinger didn’t care at all that Nixon interfered with Paris peace talks. Did McCain? The man survived five years of torture, and for what?
MM,
To me what you’re describing with FDR and JFK sounds like noblesse oblige and I would agree it seems largely absent today.
But I also wonder how FDR or JFK would fare in a world with cable news and social media.
They also need to be remembered completely, and not just based on myths, fantasies and the good things they did.
steve,
Well said. You could add several others to that list.
The upper classes used to have a sense of duty and honor that compelled at least some of them to serve their country – duty and honor seem comparatively rare today across our entire society.
Andy,
It’s that, I think, but also identification with strikes and subversion. FDR was a tricky figure, and for someone like my grandfather and his family, he was connected to something that came out of labor struggles. My father’s side were very proud of being ‘scientific’ farmers and, in their minds, gentlemen. But they also smuggled food past the National Guard during coal strikes. Or so the story goes. And they despised their relatives who went big and moved to the metropolis of Reading. Which used to be fancy!
I also think that Roosevelt coming in via radio to a completely isolated farm village in a PA valley with his great voice must have been unearthly.
I never met my grandfather, but he had an odd life. He was in the Army in France in 1918 and then came right back to where he grew up, and barely travelled and never spoke about the war, or even what he saw. He was elected as a state congressman for one term and then went back to the farm. I’ve always assumed he straddled different worlds without really knowing where to go.