I agree with some of what the editors of the Washington Post have to say although I may disagree with them in others and the reasons:
Treating allies less kindly than adversaries reflects naiveté about the threat a revanchist Russia poses to the Western world, including NATO. Zelensky does want to end the three-year war that has ravaged his country, but he is clear-eyed that a bad deal is worse than no deal because he knows that, absent ironclad security guarantees from Ukraine’s allies, Russian President Vladimir Putin cannot be trusted to uphold a ceasefire.
I agree that President Trump and Vice President Vance should have been kinder to President Zelensky. He’s in a trying situation, a novice, and under enormous pressure. I’m skeptical that Russia is a threat to Western Europe or even to Poland although Russia is undoubtedly a threat to Poland’s regaining the territory it held once upon a time. Neither Germany nor France is behaving as though they believe that Russian invasion is a likely contingency.
Their reading of history is highly selective. My own view is that we should refrain from embroiling ourselves in the grievances of other countries and focus more narrowly on our own interests.
Russia is not the problem; the US is. There have been some 250 armed conflicts since 1945, and the US initiatied over 200 of them, always against countries at peace with us. Serbia and Libya are egregious examples of Washington’s behavior, and Ukraine is the most recent example.
Obama started that war by overthrowing Ukraine’s legitimate government, and installing the current Banderite/Nazi junta. Zelenskyy is not some naif wandering lost in the forest. He is evil.
Russia avoided war for 8 years, repeatedly negotiating settlements that would have protected the civil rights of ethnic Russians in Ukraine, and would have left Ukraine intact, except for Crimea. The US and Europe sabotaged all of these agreements, because they were trying to make Russia go to war. The goal of the war was to be the collapse of a Russia that was supposedly too weak to survive a war. Then Russia would be fragmented and looted.
Trump is the first President understand that Russia is a peer superpower. Most leaders in Washington and Europe still don’t understand that. Trump is going to extricate the US and Europe from looming nuclear war, even against the wishes of other American and European leaders who are too besotted to see that.
Trump is going to save all our arses. We should be grateful.
PS You should stop reading the lunatic ravings of the war criminals in Washington. In a country of laws, the Wapo editors would be hanged.
Zelensky understands that Russia will not stick to any agreement and that the only thing like an ironclad security agreement would be the equivalent of joining NATO. So it’s not really an issue of Trump and Vance being kinder, though they could have refrained from attacking him and defending Putin (see the transcript) both at the meeting and in the days leading to the meeting.
If Trump really doesnt want to fund Ukraine he should just say that is what he is going to do. If he wants to leave NATO then say so and do it. Not much need to actually demean the country fighting off the Russian invasion. Again, just a reminder, when Russia ruled Ukraine in the past they killed off millions and deported many more. The reason there are a lot fo ethnic Russians in some part of the country is because Russia put them there.
Steve
There seem to be two different ways people view Zelenskyy. One sees him as a naive hero approaching Churchillian status. The other, a puppet of global interests who has become enamored with his own popular standing among the elites.
I tend to see the second version of Zelenskyy as being more authentic. I also think Bob Sykes has a better understanding, per his above post, of the politics and history surrounding this war.
The little information allowed to come out of Ukraine indicates Zelenskyy’s popularity has significantly eroded since the beginning of the war. His military is in tatters, with the average age of combatant to be 43 years, as Ukrainian goons continue to sweep unwilling men off the streets to serve and probably die on the front line. In the meantime the mineral deal was turned down 3 times by Zelenskyy, and yet he was the one to reach out to come over here to sign the deal. What has been bubbling up, though, is that upon advice from Rice, Blinken and other ex-officials probably violating the Logan Act, his real goal was to humiliate trump and muscle out of the US what he wanted – more money and military back-up. Senator Murphy, who was one of the senators meeting with him at the Hay Adams Hotel beforehand, has even validated the fact that Zelenskyy went into that Trump meeting determined not to sign the deal, but rather to articulate his case before the American people. Even today, Zelenskyy has come out and said he believes the war will go on for a long, long time – not very encouraging to hear from a man supposedly wanting peace.
And, while there is war and Martial Law imposed on the people of Ukraine, free elections will be put in limbo, and Zelenskyy remains president whether or not the people want him to remain as their leader. That’s where the “dictator” labeling might aptly apply.
The average age is high because 1) Ukraine has a conscript army; and 2) men under 25 are not being drafted.
I do not believe that V. Zelensky is a dictator but I also do not believe he is a freely and democratically elected president. I think he is, basically, a representative of Ukraine’s oligarchs.
We monitored his election. If he is a creature of the oligarchs then it is in the sense of that also being true in the US and most other nations.
As a reminder, it’s not Zelensky but their equivalent of Congress that votes every 90 days to maintain martial law.
Steve
Dave, what is your assessment of what being a dictator constitutes?
I know Zelenskyy was “democratically elected.” However, does that permanently establish his rule as not implementing a dictatorship? What about a leader who bans the free press, does not tolerate dissent without imprisonment, bans the Russian Orthodox Church, kills journalists in prison, kidnaps men off the street to involuntarily serve in the military …or is that not enough intolerance to reach the threshold of becoming a dictator?
Dave Schuler: My own view is that we should refrain from embroiling ourselves in the grievances of other countries and focus more narrowly on our own interests.
Sounds nice. But that didn’t work for the United States eighty-some years ago, and it is less likely to work now with the world being much more interconnected and interdependent. Meanwhile, Trump and his minions are fracturing alliances critical for maintaining international stability, making involvement in overseas conflicts more likely—not less.
jan: However, does that permanently establish his rule as not implementing a dictatorship?
The Ukrainian constitution does not allow elections during national emergencies. The United Kingdom postponed elections until VE Day, after which, the voters promptly tossed Churchill out of office.
jan: What about a leader who bans the free press,
The United States didn’t allow Nazis to propagate propaganda during WWII, even hanging propagandists after the war. In Ukraine, Russia targets journalists.
jan: does not tolerate dissent without imprisonment
Ukraine has prosecuted people who deny or justify Russia’s armed aggression, mostly with non-custodial sentences. Criticism of the current government is largely allowed. However, in Russian controlled areas, there is widespread abuse of civilians and prisoners.
jan: bans the Russian Orthodox Church
The Russian Orthodox Church openly sided with Putin and were accused of acting as Russian agents.
jan: kills journalists in prison
You probably mean the (singular) so-called journalist, Gonzalo Lira. He was arrested for spreading Russian propaganda. He reportedly died of pneumonia, which he had complained about in letters.
jan: kidnaps men off the street to involuntarily serve in the military
It’s called conscription. The United States used conscription until 1973, and there is still mandatory registration under which people can be called up. Conscription is deeply rooted in the common law.
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A pun on the draft and an ad lip at Ford’s Theater on April 14, 1865:
As written: Oh! you want to get out of the draft, do you? Well, you’re not the only one that wants to escape the draft.
As delivered: The draft has already been stopped by order of the President!