These events took place on the East Side of Chicago today. Michelle Gallardo reports at ABC 7 Chicago:
CHICAGO (WLS) — A chase involving federal agents led to a crash Tuesday afternoon on Chicago’s East Side, officials said. After the crash, a crowd gathered around agents on the scene.
Chopper 7 was over the scene about 12:10 p.m., and there was a large number of Chicago police squad cars and Border Patrol agents on the scene in the 10500-block of South Avenue N.
A neighborhood resident said a red SUV was being chased by federal agents before a crash in the area.
The Department of Homeland Security said a vehicle, driven by someone living in the U.S. without legal permission, rammed a Border Patrol vehicle that was part of an immigration enforcement operation and tried to drive away.
Border Patrol followed the vehicle for about 30 minutes, and stopped it using a precision immobilization technique, or PIT, maneuver.
Two people, both living in the U.S. without legal permission, tried to run away, DHS said. They were taken into custody.
A white Expedition and the red SUV were damaged.
Surveillance video shows they had been chasing the red vehicle in circles around the neighborhood before the crash.
The report goes on to mention that objects were thrown at the federal law enforcement officers including rocks and other objects. The video above clearly shows one of the officers being struck by a thrown object. Note that the objects were being thrown before tear gas was used.
Throwing things is not protected speech.
You keep forgetting to note stuff like this.
“”They just told me, ‘Juanita, you have an emergency. ICE took your son. They beat him up. They body-slammed him. And they took your son,'” Juanita Garnica said. “They haven’t told me anything. He’s not an immigrant. He was born and raised in Chicago.”
Or this…
“A large amount of tear gas was deployed about 12:40 p.m.
Federal agents used tear gas against a crowd on Chicago’s East Side Tuesday.
Those gathered quickly dispersed.
Federal agents had masks, but CPD did not. Some officers appeared to be affected by the gas.
CPD said 13 officers were exposed.”
So in context, there are claims that CPD is not showing up to help, but we have videos showing that they are there. We also have reports (and videos showing) that masked people without ID are taking pretty extreme actions against people with little or no provocation. We have prolonged chases on city streets endangering citizens with ICE, apparently, not prioritizing public safety.
To be perfectly clear, throwing stuff is illegal and people should face consequences. Its also very clear that the US does not have a history of masked anonymous police grabbing people and in the places in the world where that does happen it results in a totalitarian govt or people battling with those police.
Steve
You keep forgetting to note that the federal agents’ vehicle was pursuing two illegal aliens who were speeding and blowing through stop signs to evade apprehension with no sign of the CPD doing anything about it. Or that the deployment of teargas was consequent to the crowd becoming a rioting mob. The ABC 7 video at the top of the page documents both of those.
The United States also does not have a history of Mexican criminal gangs offering bounties on law enforcement officers and their families or social media websites devoted to posting pictures of law enforcement officers and doxxing them. Or for providing information useful primarily for obstructing justice.
There are other solutions to those problems than wearing masks but IMO they are more draconian and disruptive than wearing masks. For example, Mark Zuckerberg could be arrested for obstruction of justice. All things considered I don’t think that masks are so bad.
We have a history of law enforcement officers showing their faces and wearing and showing ID. There was never any purpose in doxxing them in the past. However, we do have a long history of police abusing their powers, including torturing people. Making them anonymous and unaccountable worsens those tendencies. Again, most police are decent people but there are always a significant percentage who should not be police. Of note, even the good police usually wont report the bad ones.
Bounties? So how many ICE agents have been kidnapped or killed for one of these bounties? AFAICT these claims largely come from DHS and they have a lot of self-interest in promoting those claims. Again, I have no problem with arresting and deporting illegals but we need to do it safely and legally. It’s not an emergency and we dont need goon patrols.
Steve
High speed chase? So ICE engaged in poor policing then risked members of the public by pursuing 2 people whose crime was crossing the border. From this I assume you support the police engaging in urban chases, injuring and killing civilians, for crimes like shoplifting, accounting fraud and jaywalking.
Dave Schuler: Throwing things is not protected speech.
Yes, but police have an obligation to protect or at least not harm people in the crowd, most of whom were just people in the neighborhood. It can be very difficult to balance enforcing the law, public protection, and the right to peaceably assemble; especially in a politically charged situation. But that’s why policing isn’t something for untrained federal militias. The alternative, that law enforcement can do whatever they want if someone in the crowd gets out of line, is not consistent with a democratic society.
All law enforcement need to be readily and individually identifiable.
Even the ones doing undercover investigations of the boogie man du jour?
walt moffett: Even the ones doing undercover investigations of the boogie man du jour?
Undercover police don’t wear masks. And if they make arrests, they identify themselves as police. SWAT teams sometimes wear masks, so that might be a better example. SWAT teams sometimes have visible badge numbers, but not always. They do wear easily seen identification of being law enforcement.
Individual accountability is what matters, because without accountability, there is no rule of law. If a member of ICE or SWAT commits a crime, they need to be held accountable, and that requires individual identification. That also applies to undercover police.
You raise a good point. Why weren’t the CPD preserving order rather than standing around watching?
No, I think that Chicago’s “Welcoming City” ordinance should be repealed and the CPD should go back to serving and protecting rather than standing around with their arms folded.
Dave Schuler: No, I think that Chicago’s “Welcoming City” ordinance should be repealed and the CPD should go back to serving and protecting rather than standing around with their arms folded.
The Ordinance does not require the police to ignore criminal activity. But someone throwing something in a crowd can be difficult to police. There is no evidence that the police ignored crimes. ICE was taking charge of the situation, so police were caught in the middle, concentrating on de-escalation and crash documentation.
Throwing things at officers is against the law. The video documents that. The police ignored that. Breaking the speed limit and running stop signs, also documented in the video, are also misdemeanors. Furthermore, disorderly assemblies are against Illinois law.
You are engaging in some circular logic here and we need some root cause analysis. The car is speeding because they are trying to get away from ICE. How did that get started? Was ICE after those guys because they were violentt criminals? That is not what was reported. ICE could have and should have waited to grab them when it was safer rather than when they were in a car. They know some people will run. Some people in a car will drive fast to get away. It’s not worth hitting someone in a crosswalk just to catch a couple of border crossers right now. Wait and grab them later.
Steve
That’s not circular logic. You are engaging in a fallacy called “special pleading”.
Dave Schuler: Throwing things at officers is against the law
Yes, but what would you have the police do? Even if they saw exactly what happened, which may not be the case, should they charge into the crowd with cudgels to arrest the suspect? Putting everyone else in the crowd at risk? Escalating the situation, creating more chaos, and probably resulting in additional injuries. The person who threw something can always be charged later, but the immediate concern is de-escalation.
Dave Schuler: Furthermore, disorderly assemblies are against Illinois law.
But you can’t arrest everybody in a crowd, perhaps almost everyone in the neighborhood, because they show up to protest or just to gawk, and then someone throws something. Even if you arrest everyone, it’s unlikely they would be convicted.
This is a common problem: a belief in magic police or magic laws or a magic military. But sure. They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into. I say let ’em crash.
I think they should have gotten on a bullhorn and ordered the crowd to disperse. Indeed, I think that’s what the ICE officers should have done as well.
And, yes, anyone who did not disperse should have been arrested. Their hands and feet should have been zip-tied and one to the next individual.
Why not? And they might have showed up to protest or gawk but once objects were thrown it was a riot and they were in it.
Dave Schuler: I think they should have gotten on a bullhorn and ordered the crowd to disperse. Indeed, I think that’s what the ICE officers should have done as well.
It was ICE’s operation, being the primary responders. They didn’t order the crowd to disperse, but responded with force when objects were thrown. After ICE left, the police de-escalated the situation and eventually the crowd dispersed without the use of additional force.
Dave Schuler: Why not? And they might have showed up to protest or gawk but once objects were thrown it was a riot and they were in it.
ICE was “in it”. The police were “in it”. The neighbors were “in it”, not necessarily the cause of it. But nothing says free country like mass arrests of otherwise peaceful people.