Becoming a “Scientific Nation”

Ethan Siegel has a post at Big Think that might interest you:

In every civilized society around the world, there’s a trade-off that must be made. The protection of individual freedoms, on one hand, enable the people living there to pursue their own goals, dreams, and ideals, whatever they may be. But those pursuits must not infringe on the rights?—?including the health, safety, and general welfare?—?of others. When it comes to issues like the health, safety, and long-term prosperity of our society, there is no greater tool or resource we have to assess them accurately than science.

It might seem like, at the start of 2025, we’re headed in absolutely the wrong direction. Mass firings and layoffs at the NIH, the NSF, the CDC and more, coupled with the installation of a number of prominent anti-science cabinet members, the first deadly measles outbreak among children in a decade, and the USA’s withdrawal (again) from the Paris Climate Agreement all signal a national move away from science.

But this is not new. The fact is that Americans have been resistant to heeding the scientific consensus on matters of public policy for many decades, preferring stances that agree with their ideological preferences instead. This was highlighted in 2020 and beyond, as many refused to mask, vaccinate, or isolate at even the height of the COVID-19 pandemic. This disregard for scientific facts extends even to the vilification of the scientists that find them, resulting in policies that recklessly endanger not only the health and safety of Americans today, but provide new generations with long-term challenges that they’ll need to either reckon with or face the consequences.But hope remains, as we’re just four key steps away from putting America back on the right track. Here’s what we can do.

His “four steps” are

  1. Put an end to the “false equivalence” game
  2. Make “reckless endangerment” illegal.
  3. Value society’s right to benefit from humanity’s accumulated knowledge.
  4. Fund science—including basic, fundamental research?—?as a national priority.

Although I agree with his point in the abstract I’m not sure that his “four steps” will accomplish anything.

There are several points I don’t think he recognizes. First, the history of science is littered with cases in which the “scientific consensus” was wrong. At one point or other the scientific consensus was that the sun revolved around the earth; that species could not become extinct; that the shapes and locations of the continents were immutable; that the material world was composed of fire, water, earth, and air; that bad air was the primary cause of disease (the “miasma theory”), and so on. My conclusion from that is that science and scientists are not the same thing.

Related to that is that is impossible to “fund science”. We can only fund scientists and considerable effort is required to ensure that we are not encouraging people to provide grants to their friends or pursuing something other than science rather than to advancing science. Furthermore, no amount of research would have proven the existence of the ether. That’s why I favor funding mass engineering projects over funding basic research. Basically, we’ve gotten better results in basic science from mass engineering programs than we have from funding basic scientific research directly.

I also found this passage amusing:

We have the means, the knowledge, the resources, and the capability of:

  • making every municipal water supply in the country safe to drink
  • practically eradicating preventable diseases that have resurged (such as measles) in recent years
  • supplying 100% of our energy needs with green (nuclear, solar, wind, or other renewable) sources by 2050 or sooner
  • drastically curtailing the spread of respiratory diseases, including the flu and COVID-19, in the American population

This:

supplying 100% of our energy needs with green (nuclear, solar, wind, or other renewable) sources by 2050 or sooner

is something I might agree with but I cannot think of a single politician who believes that or, at least, has articulated it in public. Additionally, I think that it is equally true that we could supply 100% of our energy needs with nuclear power but NOT with solar, wind, or other renewable sources. The reasons that an “all of the above” strategy makes sense are cost and expense.

Also, wouldn’t it require vaccinating 100% of the population against, say, measles which I believe is an unachievable goal, to eradicate measles as long as we are admitting unvaccinated individuals from other countries into the United States? To the best of my knowledge only five countries have actually eradicated measles: Bhutan, North Korea, Maldives, Sri Lanka, and Timor-Leste. Two of those are isolated and the other three relatively small islands. Consequently, I’m skeptical we can eradicate them but we might be able to “drastically curtail them”.

At any rate read the whole thing. You’ll find things you agree with and things you’ll disagree with.

4 comments… add one
  • bob sykes Link

    1. As to renewables, that is a fantasy. Francis Menton at Manhattan Contrarian has a large number of posts regarding the economics of renewables. They are impossible.

    https://www.manhattancontrarian.com

    The killer is the batteries needed to iron out the intermittency. To run the US on renewables, we would need to buy batteries costing fully one-half of the total GDP. They only last a decade or so, which means the running cost of battery replacement is 5 to10% of total GDP each year.

    That does not include the costs of the generators nor the required transmission grid. The grid has to be much larger than convention generators, because renewable are so diffuse.

    2. I worked 37 years in academia as an environmental engineer/scientist, 35 at a major research institute. One of the major untold disasters of recent decades is the politicization and corruption of science. All the nonsense once restricted to the humanities and social sciences has now spread to the physical sciences and engineering. There is a replication crisis in every field, even physics (!!!). Wokeness controls hiring promotion, publications, et al. The tendentious reporting of so-called results is commonplace. In my own field, it is hard to know what reality is. Did anything actually happen at Love Canal? Maybe, maybe not. It’s fundamentally unknowable because of the politics.

    By the way, if anything did happen at Love Canal, the local school board and town did it, not Hooker Chemical. They are the ones who broke the seal on the hazardous waste site.

  • Zachriel Link

    Dave Schuler: First, the history of science is littered with cases in which the “scientific consensus” was wrong.

    “All models are wrong, but some are useful” — George E. P. Box

    Dave Schuler: At one point or other the scientific consensus was that the sun revolved around the earth

    The Relativity of Wrong: “when people thought the Earth was flat, they were wrong. When people thought the Earth was spherical, they were wrong. But if you think that thinking the Earth is spherical is just as wrong as thinking the Earth is flat, then your view is wronger than both of them put together.” — Isaac Asimov

    Dave Schuler: Furthermore, no amount of research would have proven the existence of the ether.

    Funding of research into the existence of ether led to significant scientific advances, including Einstein’s Theory of Special Relativity. See Michelson & Morley, On the Relative Motion of the Earth and the Luminiferous Ether, American Journal of Science 1887.

    Dave Schuler: Basically, we’ve gotten better results in basic science from mass engineering programs than we have from funding basic scientific research directly.

    Pure science has been the foundation of virtually all advances in modern engineering. You could start with Newton or Faraday or Watson/Crick/Franklin.

    Dave Schuler: Also, wouldn’t it require vaccinating 100% of the population against, say, measles which I believe is an unachievable goal, to eradicate measles as long as we are admitting unvaccinated individuals from other countries into the United States?

    Measles has a R0 of about 12-18, meaning an infected person will cause an average of 12-18 secondary cases in a susceptible population. Two doses of the vaccine are about 97% effective. Consequently, vaccination rates of about 95% (19/20) will stop most outbreaks. Some people can’t be successfully vaccinated, including newborns, which is why it is important for the general population to be vaccinated.

    “There’s no vaccine that is, you know, safe and effective.” — Robert F. Kennedy Jr., United States Secretary of Health and Human Services

  • steve Link

    1) All of the instances you cite as science being wrong come from times when science was pretty primitive. They may have practiced some elements of scientific method but I dont think anyone really regards those people as scientists per se. They were also very limited by their ability to measure and observe stuff. Heliocentrism kind of made sense if you couldn’t measure parallax. Science improved those tools and we got better observations and better conclusions. There are other times when scientists have been wrong but rarely about the big things and when wrong it’s usually corrected pretty quickly by real science. Also science then was often mixed with religion/philosophy and keeping the king happy. Of note scientific studies, different from science, will always have a percentage that are wrong. You have to set your confidence intervals somewhere, or p values if you are older. That’s why replication studies are important, but funding is harder to get for those it wont do much to advance your career.

    2) All too often I think science is confused with policy recommendations made by scientists or people claiming to base their decisions on science. Scientists have expertise in science, not so much in policy.

    3) The rate of vaccinations internationally for measles is 83%, which is much better than Idaho at 79%. We have 14 states with vaccination rates below 90%. While we have had a few outbreaks related to immigrants like the Somali outbreak in 2017, but the very large majority of cases and outbreaks are related to unvaccinated Americans traveling abroad and brining measles back. Outbreaks then occur if they bring them back to an area where many other people are not vaccinated.

    So if Americans were vaccinated at or above the herd immunity rate then outbreaks wouldn’t happen and we would just have the occasional isolated case. Since we have many areas with low vax rates and it’s getting worse we will continue to see more outbreaks. If history holds immigrants will be a minor factor. (Texas is currently considering a bill that would relax vaccine requirements.)

    Steve

  • steve Link

    Just a reminder, while we have had a few small outbreaks like with the Hassidic Jews or Somalis, the last really large outbreak that i can find was from 1989-1991 when Reagan cut back funding for public health and a lot of people lost access to vaccinations. If memory serves we had about 60,000 cases as a result. (Historically, about 1 out of 4 cases got hospitalized but we are better at keeping kids hydrated now without hospitalization so I would expect that to be lower. Most recent large study I can find goes from 2002-2016 and death rate for those hospitalized was 3%. Used NIS data rather than NNDSS so probably more comprehensive.)

    Steve

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